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The above is not from the bible rather an attempt on the sura like it Quran challenge, after reading it thoroughly, it does not sound to me like sura like it, nor its author is a god, it can NOT be like it of course
I will try and translate it later today inshaallah
Status: Age: 42 Faith: Islam Gender:
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Salam Brother AB,
NOT yes ofcourse was there in the sense i meand NOT for the ones who cant understand Arabic and really easily to befool us.
I meant challenge NOT to the Quran but to Muslims who dont understand Arabic its a challenge for them as they are easy fish to catch for the deceivers.
The word challenge is for the Non-Arab muslims who dont understand Arabic. How the heck they will chanllenge the Quran i know they cant because more than the Arabic there is much more to the Quran i.e. according to my own analysis, so its not only the language they will challenge but much more than that.
Brother AB more than the translation i wanna know how can we differentiate the above crap from the Quran
Posted:
Sat 29 Sep, 2007 8:56 pm
AhmedBahgat Site Admin
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Salam brother SOA
Just finished the 20 verses/day that I have to translate, a lot of work bro, I hope I will be able to finish it inshaallah
Let me reply to the above thread:
Firstly if I remember well, I think I got mixed up to what the above is, I believe that it is made by a new Christian sect in the M. E., not sure when it emerged, I believe that they are related to Jehovah�?????�????�???�??�?�¢??s Witness, what those smart arses did is simply strike two birds with one strike, the first bird is to show that they can produce a sura like it, and the second bird is to create a new religion based on a very popular and attractive religious book (Al Quran), the second bird is their main objective to attract followers from both religions (Islam and Christianity) the biggest two religion on the planet. Now if we look at the writing below, it may seem for the first impression as if it is a Quran sura:
Thumbnail, click to enlarge.
However, there is a major distinction between the above and a real Quran sura, as you can see above, the verse number in their man made book is in front of the verses while in the real Quran the verse number is at the end of the verse, this is not a major issue though, rather a clear visual evidence to even those who know nothing about Arabic that it can't be a Quran sura
Regarding a sura like it challenge, we need to compare the two (mainly) in two major aspects, the source and the content
For the source, the challengers failed because the words above are not from a god and if they are from a god then according to the Quran challenge, that god needs to come forward and give witness that it is indeed his words, that is the condition required by the Quran so the true believers consider the challengers as truthful, now by looking at the content we will see clearly that it can't be from a god, rather a human who is influenced by the flawed Christian faith, that is why the content is very important to study.
Before studying the content brought by the challengers, of course it has to be in Arabic and they passed that aspect, on the other hand we still need to study their content grammatically, but I�?????�????�???�??�?�¢??m not going to do that for the time being, what I'm going to do is to study the message of the content, that is why the translation is very important for those who don't speak or read Arabic, it is as important as the real Quran translation, so let me get on with it and explain the content to you and you should recognise with ease that it is nothing but a load of non sense:
It seems it is a chapter numbered 27 named Sakinah, i.e. the feel good
Here we go, it is sort of the man made feel good religion for starter
They start by saying the same Arabic words used in the Quran Bism Allah Al Rahman Al Rahim, now this has to be a clear cut case of theft from the Quran unless they bloody concede that their god is the same god of the Quran, who is Allah. and if that is the case then their god (Allah) has to come forward to give witness that it is his words, indeed they must fail to do so, consequently and without even looking at the rest, their lies must be dismissed, but let me be fair and have a look at their man made crap
Here is what the first verse says: Qul Ya Ayuha Al Lazin Amanu In Kuntum Amantum Bi Allah Haqqa Fa Aminu Bi Wa La Takhafu, In Lakum Ind Allah Janaat Nuzula
Now, there is something illogical in the above, that is Allah sends messengers so they inform the people that Allah exists and they should believe in Him the right way (truthfully), now, the people should believe the messenger first before they may believe in Allah truthfully (logically speaking), for example if the people already believe in Allah the right way (truthfully) then no messenger should be sent, see, Allah only sends messengers when their belief in Him is flawed.
Let me translate the above crap numbered 27:1
Say: O believers, if you believe in Allah the right way (truthfully), then believe in me and don't be scared, there is for you at Allah gardens that are sent down
See bro, total non sense, they already believe in Allah the right way In Kuntum Amantum Bi Allah Haqqa, see the word Haqqa, i.e. if you believe in Allah the right way, why the hell they need messengers to believe in them then?
Let's look at verse 27:2
Fa Li Asbiqqankum Ila Allah Li Auidiha Lakum, Thumma Li Atianakum Nazlah Aukhra
LOL, here is the translation to the above crap:
So I will go to Allah before you to prepare it for you (the garden), then I will come back to you again
What a load of non sense that is bro, no human prepares the heaven for the rest of humans, it can only be prepared by Allah as stated numerous times in the Quran, the above is a clear cut contradiction regarding the concept of Allah. Another clear contradiction in the same verse that the suppose to be messenger is telling them that he is has to come back to earth again, see, that is the corruption of the return of Jesus (I say), why the hell he has to come back?, he never said why in the above crap, of yeh, to tell them that the gardens are bloody ready for them, holy non sense brother SOA
Let's have a look at verse 27:3
Wa Inakum La Tarifoon Al Sabil Ila Qiblati Al Ulia, Fa Qal Lahu Tuma Al Hawari: Mawlana, Ina La namlik Min Zalik Ilma
Lol again, here is the translation bro:
And you should know the way to my high Qiblah, then the disciples spokesman said to him: Our guardian, We have absolutely no knowledge about that
, man this is so funny indeed, see what the suppose to be messenger said to them: And you should know the way to my high Qiblah, not Allah Qiblah, but his high Qiblah, another funny point in the above is, he is telling them that they should have known the way to (his Qiblah), I say he must meant (the way to the garden), then they replied to him by saying that they have absolutely no idea about that, a contradiction with 27:1 because he told them that if they already believed in Allah truthfully, i.e. they must have known the way to Allah truthfully, LOL
Let's now look at the last verse 27:4, I'm not going to look at 27:5 because it is not complete in the image above:
Fa Qal Lahu Isa: Ina Hua Al Sirat Ila Allah Haqqa, Wa Min Doni La Tastatioon Ilaihi Sabila
What can I say bro, well here is the translation before I say anything:
Then Jesus said to him: It is me who is the way to Allah truthfully, and without me you can't know the way to him
Well, the above verse contradicted 27:1 again, this because he asked them if they already believed in Allah (Truthfully) or (the right way) then they have to believe in him, in here he is telling them that he is the only way for them to believe in Allah
-----------------------------
I say it is not a very smartly composed theft however it is a smart enough con job to attract many fools
Status: Age: 42 Faith: Islam Gender:
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Thanks a lot bro AB. I wonder where do these guys come from, dont they have brains of what they are writing. So that we shall be befooled.
Overall its more of a challenge for me to understand Arabic and buckle up for the challenge. Let me do a bit for the sake of Allaah.
Yes that was funny the already know Allaah is the truth and then after knowing that why should Isa be the only way. Common now this is a joke and just imagine 5 verses and contradiction is already found.
Probably tried to hard on concentrating on the theme of Arabic but couldnt concentrate on the other Parts.
I just have a question bro do you think by any chance that this is going to pose a challenge for Non-Arabic Muslims as these fish catchers will be looking out for people every nook and corner.
Posted:
Sun 30 Sep, 2007 3:15 am
BMZ Moderator
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SlaveofAllaah wrote:
Thanks a lot bro AB. I wonder where do these guys come from, dont they have brains of what they are writing. So that we shall be befooled.
Overall its more of a challenge for me to understand Arabic and buckle up for the challenge. Let me do a bit for the sake of Allaah.
Yes that was funny the already know Allaah is the truth and then after knowing that why should Isa be the only way. Common now this is a joke and just imagine 5 verses and contradiction is already found.
Probably tried to hard on concentrating on the theme of Arabic but couldnt concentrate on the other Parts.
I just have a question bro do you think by any chance that this is going to pose a challenge for Non-Arabic Muslims as these fish catchers will be looking out for people every nook and corner.
That is why it is important to learn and teach our children so that any forgery can be detected. It happened a few years ago, when there was a Sura Muslimoon, sent to Muslims. Please make everyone at least memorise the names of the 114 Surahs.
BMZ
Posted:
Sun 30 Sep, 2007 4:06 pm
AhmedBahgat Site Admin
Status: Age: 59 Faith: Islam Gender:
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Hello all
On FFI web site a christian goon in the name of brainout posted the following crap:
brainout of FFI said:
Click here for this Maltese video and listen to it closely. It's in Arabic with quite decent English subtitles, but if you've heard enough Qu'ran recitation, you can tell it's being matched up. This is really good. It answers so much of what's said against Christ being the Son of God.
Very impressive. I found it by mistake at Youtube.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Another freak neamed Searcher posted the following link to a wen site that alleg to have invented a whole Quran:
surah al muslimoon, i can even recite it with tajweed. wow. oh my days, wow. oh crap. haha, i may sound confused, but i didnt read this surah untill after i sent the previous post. how strange! Really i believed it hadnt been done, can some muslim please come and defend this, perhaps im not so great at arabic, i mean ive only done up to alevel arabic...
BUt wait, this one is really good, oh great... http://www.suralikeit.com/
surah al muslimoon, i can even recite it with tajweed. wow. oh my days, wow. oh crap. haha, i may sound confused, but i didnt read this surah untill after i sent the previous post. how strange! Really i believed it hadnt been done, can some muslim please come and defend this, perhaps im not so great at arabic, i mean ive only done up to alevel arabic...
I have read it and it's nothing but a cheap try by some idiots who read the Quran and stole from it many sentences, possibly over 70% of that crap you read then they added words in between to make a context that only defame the Muslims, a huge contradiction is in sentences number 5 & 6 where it says that the Muslims kafaaro (rejected) the torah and injil, while in the Quran they HAVE TO BELIEVE IN THEM ALONG WITH THE QURAN to be called believers, i.e. every single Muslim believes in the Torah and Injil, however we don't see the Torah nor the Injil now days, we only see 4 man made books for the NT and a corrupted book for the OT, both are in one book called bible
now, check with any jew, you should see that they follow something called Talmud not the OT, the OT which suppose to be representing the Torah, i.e. they don't believe in nor follow the Torah
and if you check with any christian you will see that they don't believe in the OT as well, of course the OT suppose to be a copy of the Torah, i.e. they don't believe in the Torah either
if you read the Torah in the copy of it that called OT you should see that a God is talking, however if you read the 4 gospels which suppose to be the Injil, you should see that a man is talking, of course if the god was the one talking he would have sent ONE injil not 4 that contradict each other, the Quran also said that the Injil was sent from God, i.e. He must be the one talking in it exactly as the Torah and the Quran, but that is not the case of course, i.e. the true Injil does not exist
summerizing the above
1) the muslims believe in the Quran, the Torah and the Injil, and because the last two books can't be found in their original state, the Muslims only believe in the passages found in the current man made book called bible that are qualified by the Quran, i.e. the Muslims virtually believe in the Injil and Torah
2) the Jews don't believe in the current 4 gospels, not even one passage of it, which suppose to be representing the Injil, nor they follow the OT which suppose to be representing the Torah
3) the christians don't believe in the OT which suppose to be the Torah, not one passage of it
therefore senteces 5&6 in this man made crap are actually talking about the Jews and Christians not the Muslimoon
see how I cracked it, now I can crack every single so caleed sura in there, but I don't have time to waste with such child play, in fact it seems to me that you totally misunderstand what the sura like it challenge is, that is if I even consider it a challange to prove something to the kafirs, in reality though, it is a challenge to prove somthing to the Muslims
then I added the following comment:
Hello green-eyes
here is a grammar mistake
see that start of the last sentence, it say, Wa Inna Qaddia Allah Amaraa
this sentence is stolen from the Quran, however they changed a device in it as if it is their sentence, and they faulted in the process of doing so, the Quran sentence is : "Wa Iza Qaddia Allah Amraa ",
can you see the underlined words, in the fake sentence is Inna, and in the Quran sentence is Iza
i.e. When Allah decrees an order
their problem though changeing it to Inn, that Inn must be followed by a noun, it can only be followed by a verb if you ommit the noun doing the verb, this is a common rule in the Arabic grammar that is called Inna and Akhawatiha
Now if you look at the fake sentence, Wa Inna Qaddia Allah,, you see the verb Qaddia came after Inna, however the noun doing the verb "Allah" is there, i.e. the whole sentence structure is 100% wrong
i.e. they fuked up and exposed their stupid arses
cheers
--------------------------------------
Then green-eyes replied to me as follow
green-eyes of FFI said:
yes yes i see that grammer mistake now, yup, but didnt the quran have grammer mistakes, e.g, kayfa kana aqebatul...
i mean shouldnt it be kayfa kaanat aaqebatul.. because aaqibah is feminine.
i mean if the quran has a grammer mistake, cant this have one too?
see makes a surah like it.
its funny that when i asked my grammer teacher about this, she said it was a miracle, because allah is showing that he doesnt have to follow rues..
Sure surah al araaf verse 84, 86.. if you can tell me how this isnt a grammer mistake id be happy. shoulld it not be kaanat...
--------------------------------------
And here is my reply to the above alegation:
Ok green-eyes, I found it
I actually found it hard to read your English words expressing Arabic words, however after a few trials and few searches in the Quran, I found what you means, there are over 20 examples, and I checked them all, obviously the professor you talked too lack a few important facts regarding the Arabic grammar
feminine words dealt as feminine, however if you check all the 23 cases in the Quran where you see the words Ã??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¢?Ã??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¦..كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ , Kayfa Kana AaqibatÃ??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¢?Ã??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¦.., you will notice something that is shared between all cases, that is, the sentence did not stop at the word Aaqibat rather there is another word(s) that link to it and come straight after it, let me show you an example:
Indeed there have been examples before you; therefore travel in the earth and see what was the end of the rejecters. [The Quran ; 3:137]
قَدْ خَلَتْ مِن قَبْلِكُمْ سُنَنٌ فَسِيرُواْ فِي الأَرْضِ فَانْظُرُواْ كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ الْمُكَذَّبِينَ (137)
-> See above, the words are: كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ الْمُكَذَّبِينَ , Kayfa Kana Aaqibat Al Mukkazibeen, the sentence can never stop at the word Aaqibat, otherwise it will not be a complete sentence because the word Aaqibat DOES NOT HAVE THE AL, if it stops at the word Aaqibat, THEN IT HAS TO HAVE THE AL, i.e. Al Aaqibah, in this case we are dealing with a single word that is feminine therefore WE HAVE TO USE THE WORD KANAT, i.e. it should look like this: كيف كانت العاقبه , YOU WILL NEVER SEE THIS SENTECE IN THE QURAN, however I can show you an identical example:
O would that it had made the end. [The Quran ; 69:27]
يَا لَيْتَهَا كَانَتِ الْقَاضِيَةَ (27)
-> See how the word used is KANAT and what came after it is a single feminine word that have the Al, كَانَتِ الْقَاضِيَةَ Kanat Al Qadiah, in here the word Kanat MUST BE feminine.
In all 23 cases where we have the words Kayfa Kan AaqibatÃ??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¢?Ã??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¦, the word Aaqibat DOES NOT HAVE THE AL, this will put it in a grammatical position called Muddaf, i.e. we need to add something to it to make full sense which is called Muddaf Ilaih, (the Muddaf and Muddaf Ilaih is one of the most common grammar rules in Arabic), for the verse above the Muddaf Ilaih is the word الْمُكَذَّبِينَ , Al Mukkazibeen, i.e. The rejectors, now, what you should judge as feminine or masculine is not only the Muddaf, BUT THE MUDDAF AND MUDDAF ILAIH, in this case we are talking about a plural of many Aaqibahs (punishments) to all those people before us combined, and in this case we may use the word KANA as masculine because we are talking about PLURAL which is THE PUNISHMENTS OF THOSE WHO REJECTED
That is a tough rule in the Arabic grammar, it actually falls under the Arabic BALAGHA and the whole point of it is to make the pronunciation easy on the tongue
Try to read it for yourself as follow:
Kayfa Kanat Aaqibat Al Mukkazibeen
See the two pronounced T, in the two words Kanat Aaqibat, the second T must be pronounced to link to the Muddaf Ilaih Al Mukkazibeen, and the first T is dropped to deal with the Muddaf and Muddaf Ilaih as a whole, which is Plural, and with plurals we may use masculine
I hope I made it clear to you. Now print what I said to that professor and see what he is going to tell you
Btw very rare Arabs who know this stuff, they just didn�?????�????�???�??�?�¢??t bother to learn it because it will never affect their use of Arabic, if they want to pronounce the sentences the hard way then so be it, it will still be understood of course, but that can not be the case with the Quran because it was made easy on the tongue to be remembered
For the two verses she referred to, I replied as follow:
green_eyes wrote:
Sure surah al araaf verse 84, 86.. if you can tell me how this isnt a grammer mistake id be happy. shoulld it not be kaanat...
84: And We rained upon them a rain; consider then what was the end of the criminals.
86: And do not lie in wait in every path, threatening and turning away from Allah's way him who believes in Him and seeking to make it crooked; and remember when you were few then He multiplied you, and consider what was the end of the mischief-makers. [The Quran ; 7:84 & 86]
وَأَمْطَرْنَا عَلَيْهِم مَّطَرًا فَانظُرْ كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ الْمُجْرِمِينَ (84)
-> See in 84, exactly as I told you, itÃ??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¢??s a case of a plural Muddaf and Muddaf Ilaih عَاقِبَةُ الْمُجْرِمِينَ , Aaqibat Al Mujrimeen, the end of the criminals
-> As well in 86, exactly as I told you, itÃ??????Ã?????Ã????Ã???Ã??Ã?¢??s a case of a plural Muddaf and Muddaf Ilaih عَاقِبَةُ الْمُفْسِدِينَ , Aaqibat Al Mufsideen, the end of the mischief-makers.
Cheers
-------------------------------------
Her final reply was this:
green-eyes of FFI said:
Yeah thanks ahmad that makes much more sense. I know arabs do do things so as to make it easy to pronounce, i tried with the T and it just didnt work, okay, sigh, man she was doing masters....
But i wont just take your word for it, I'll also confirm it with my teacher at college, i hope she knows.
I mean though slowly im moving away from Islam, the quran is still pretty cool, i listen to it alot, and still recite it, because its just so nice on the tongue. Like surah assfaat is awesome to read. _________________ http://free-islam.com
Posted:
Fri 21 Dec, 2007 7:52 am
interested Pawn
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Aslamolaykum brother AhmedBahgat,
I really enjoyed reading ur debate with green_eyes. Good work.
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Please make everyone at least memorise the names of the 114 Surahs.
